The first to escape from Azkaban, really? I don't think so . . . Options

[Roderick]

Do you remember that in poA everyone said that Sirius was the first person to get out of Azkaban? . . . but he wasn't, why?:

Because if you think so, in GoF we meet Barty Crouch Jr. and we learn that he escaped from Azkaban like a year before. So year 4 - 1 = year 3 (duh ) and year 3 happened in PoA . . .so was really Sirius the first to escape?

Also, if you remember, Sirius said in GoF that he saw the Dementors burrying(sp) Barty Jr. but his fake was to let his mother die in Azkaban, so Barty Escaped first . . .

Am I right?

What do you think?



PS: If this have already being discussed, just erase the topic, but tell me where the disscusion is

[willbo]

sirius was the first to escape from what people knew. No-one knew that barty crouch jr had escaped. Barty's mum came into azkaban and they used polyjuice potion. barty crouch's mum left azkaban but it was really barty crouch jr. his mum stayed in azkaban taking polyjuice potion until she died. she was still barty crouch when she was buried so everyone just thought that barty crouch had died. so, noone knew or guessed that barty crouch had escaped. they had all "seen" him buried. the only one that they knew had escaped was sirius so in a way, they were sort of correct.

[mafalda]

But does Barty Jr's escape really count at all? I mean when you think about it he went from one form of imprisonment to another. At least when Sirius escaped he was in control of himself. It wasn't until Harry's forth year, a whole year after Sirius' escape, that Barty Jr. was in control of himself.

Well that's my two knuts worth.
Mafalda

[>Xenon]

Ah yes. He did escape didn't he. In a fashion. Only Sirius' was recognised though.


I can't believe that out of the hundreds of year that Azkaban has been in function, only one person escaped. I mean, lots of other wizards and witches can transfigurate. I'm sure Sirius' case wasn't entirely unique in that he could tranfigure into something and had a not-happy-not-sad thought. Hm. Debatable.

[Ernest]

Yes, but didn't Sirius not allow himself to be affected by the Dementors?

I would have thought that a lot of the prisoners in Azkaban would have been incapable of even thinking about escape due to the dementure that they would be suffering as a result of being around the Dementors.

[>Xenon]

Sirius said that he wasn't affected as much because he had a though that wasn't happy enough to be drained out of him or something to that effect. So possibly there are others. We know Fudge's capability of exxagerating these type of things.

[willbo]

actually, sirius said that he had one thing that no other prisoner there had - he knew he was innocent. he then said that this isnt a happy thought so the dementors couldnt drain it out of him. it was this that helped him keep his sanity.

[pwca]

MY question is, how many have really escaped? I mean we already know of two, and (though I love Sirius) neither were really exceptional wizards. So how many more had slipped thru the cracks?

[be_safe]

Barty's mom took the place Barty Jr. in prison, so no one knew. But, Sirius was the first that we know of.

[mafalda]

That's the thing isn't it?

The only possible way to escape requires alot of work and alot of help. Barty Jnr. probably only got visitors because his dad was the MoM and pulled strings to make it happen. Then ofcourse his mother talked Barty Snr. into letting them swap places, they had to make the potion before getting to Azkaban, and ensure there was enough for her to drink right up until her death. Oh and add to all that the fact that the Dementors can affect some people so badly they can't think straight. When you think about it all, its not likely that anyone eles would have been able to do it without being caught.

Mafalda

[pwca]

however, who is to say that some of the prisoners didn't have outside help? can the dementors even tell the difference between people? Otherwise couldn't a prisoner just knock out a visitor and cast a transfiguration spell on him/her self and leave? Who would be the wiser?

[Mad-Eye Moody]

That's the thing isn't it?

The only possible way to escape requires alot of work and alot of help. Barty Jnr. probably only got visitors because his dad was the MoM and pulled strings to make it happen. Then ofcourse his mother talked Barty Snr. into letting them swap places, they had to make the potion before getting to Azkaban, and ensure there was enough for her to drink right up until her death. Oh and add to all that the fact that the Dementors can affect some people so badly they can't think straight. When you think about it all, its not likely that anyone eles would have been able to do it without being caught.

Mafalda

Barty Crouch Senior was NOT not the Minister For Magic. He was Head of the Magical Law Enforcment Squad I think. But no. He was never the Minister for Magic.


Anyone, back to the subject of the topic. I read somewhere someone said that surely other Animagi were in Azkaban. But only 3 people were unregistered and rarely was there any unregistered ones. And who esle would of gone to Azkaban who was innocent?

Moody

[minisnitch]

well i guess we kind of know that none of the death eaters actaully escaped or else voldie would have come back much sooner. and yes they say sirius is the only one to escaped because yes, they just didnt know about crouch.

[dain bramaged]

well i guess we kind of know that none of the death eaters actaully escaped or else voldie would have come back much sooner. and yes they say sirius is the only one to escaped because yes, they just didnt know about crouch.

It was never announced to the whole wizarding community,was it? But any way...Sirius escaped before Crouch right?

[Liza]

This is a great thread.

I guess you're right, Roderick. Barty Crouch Jr was probably the first to escape from Azkaban but nobody apart from his father, mother [who died] and Winky knew about that so for the wizarding community Sirius was the first.

[Timeimperfect]

I think you're right - I think Barty was the first to "escape", but I think that's the wrong term to use because he didn't plan it and he had help to get out.

When I think of "escape", I imagine digging tunnels with spoons (lol), formulating an escape plan, finding an accessible route to the outside.

When you think about it, others may have got out, but just didn't make it to land - Azkaban is in the middle of the sea, right? Obviously, since no escaped criminal was out on the streets, no one would have brought it to public attention that anyone had escaped because people would start asking question about how secure it actually is.

As others have said no one knew Barty jnr had "escaped" because his mother took his place under the guise of Polyjuice Potion. Therefore, to public knowledge and to the dementors, Sirius was the fist to escape and survive the treacherous journey back.